Best Web Design Software

Discussion in 'Web Design' started by ian, Aug 27, 2004.

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Best Web Design Software

  1. Microsoft Frontpage

    2 vote(s)
    3.7%
  2. Macromedia Dreamweaver

    29 vote(s)
    53.7%
  3. Other....

    23 vote(s)
    42.6%
  1. StephanieCordray

    StephanieCordray New Member

    Messages:
    1,017
    I'm not that fast z and not very good at it to begin with, lol.. I do better making individual pieces than I do putting a web page together... takes me a lot longer. knowing how to use Dreamweaver, FP, or anything else ain't gonna make me any better or faster at it.
     
  2. drummondjacob

    drummondjacob New Member

    Messages:
    13
    "Given the attitude exhibited here toward the product none of you would know that without looking in the source code so don't be so quick to judge..." - StephanieCordray

    That's my point, I have looked at the code that FP writes and I can safely say it's awful.

    Not so much the HTML, but the internal stylesheets don't comply with some W3C standards. Furthermore why doesn't FP give one the option to use external CSS, thereby drastically lowering file size and loading time.

    Regarding a statement by StephanieCordray: "I like having both the code and design view available at all times... I can't do that in FP." - I believe that was one of the perks of FP2003, split view?
     
  3. StephanieCordray

    StephanieCordray New Member

    Messages:
    1,017
    I haven't invested in FP2003 having decided that I can stick with Dreamweaver for any project I'm working on. I have heard a lot of good things about the newest version though.

    The newest version of Dreamweaver ain't all that clean, either. I wind up changing a lot of stuff in the code because it puts unnecessary junk in there.
     
  4. drummondjacob

    drummondjacob New Member

    Messages:
    13
    "I wind up changing a lot of stuff in the code because it puts unnecessary junk in there." - StephanieCordray

    That's a fair statement and on the whole I agree. However I would like to point out that DWM2004 writes code with multi-browser compatbilty in mind, so its code will render more-or-less the same in all browsers. Unlike FP that writes code, understandably, for IE

    Having said all that you must agree with me that FP generated code is bloated - moreso than DW.
     
  5. StephanieCordray

    StephanieCordray New Member

    Messages:
    1,017
    Well, I can't really because the last version I tried came with Office 2000, lol... based on that I'd have to say yes but without a current version to compare side by side with my current version of Dreamweaver it wouldn't be fair to say so.
     
  6. drummondjacob

    drummondjacob New Member

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    13
    Thank you and Fair enough
     
  7. Wynnefield

    Wynnefield New Member

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    48
    i wasn't aware of any other tool than dw?? ...
     
  8. SuperSmash

    SuperSmash New Member

    Messages:
    9
    I've tried out most of the the WYSIWYG editors out there (though surprisingly, not FP) and find that I prefer just hand-coding the stuff. Especially since many, if not most, of my sites have PHP embedded in them, it benefits me to know my code inside out. Plus, its just a comfort thing :p I just use BBedit (fear my Apple). It's just my style though; who knows, maybe I'd be more productive if I settled down with DreamWeaver or something ;-)
     
  9. StephanieCordray

    StephanieCordray New Member

    Messages:
    1,017
    I don't think anything makes us more productive but that statement about being comfortable really sums it up. Everybody has different ways of being comfortable which is why there is a proliferation of web design software and the ensuing arguments about which one is best, :) .
     
  10. Wynnefield

    Wynnefield New Member

    Messages:
    48
    i agree with you stephanie ... it's all about the "comfort zone". no matter what tools i use, as long as i understand them well (including their limitations), the process is easier ...

    when i first started out, i was using a text editor specifically because i wanted to understand the code. after learning html, i tried a few of the freeware, shareware and gougeware options, including hotdog, hotmetal ... remember adobe pagemill 1.0 and 2.0?? i thought that was going to be king of web tool hill! ... :eek:

    dreamweaver has become my tool of choice for a number of reasons: i like the code/wysiwyg split screen, the site maintenance tools, the behaviors, the asp/php tools and other internal java scripting ... the reference guides are full of helpful information as well, but i guess that's also all over the internet ... lol

    oh well, i remember when it used to be word vs. wordperfect and lotus vs. excel, too ... it's all personal choice and comfort level ...

    wynne
     
  11. Darksat

    Darksat New Member

    Messages:
    2
    I hand code myself or if im on a linux system I use NVU because its free and open source.
     
    Last edited: Feb 9, 2005
  12. Vaelor

    Vaelor New Member

    Messages:
    111
    I just had two pretty full on experiences, one good and one bad, which I feel are very relevant to this thread...

    Situation #1

    Upon learning that Google AdSense do actually manually approve their affiliate applications, I was faced with a dilemma. I've never liked the idea of having to build your whole site, apply for an affiliate program, and THEN go back through and edit all your affiliate links in, I think that's ridiculous. So I needed a site that would be approved, without going to the trouble of designing an actual site, with actual content.

    The site you'll see now at http://www.fifthdimensioncomputing.com/ was the result. Using NoteTab, I banged together that site, complete with a forum, an online store, news links, and more, in less than two hours. That's hand coding, from scratch. A few hours later, I was approved for Google AdSense, and now I can start working on my real site.

    Granted, the site you see there is relatively pointless and has no real value, but still, it's a multi-page, tidy layout, fully functional niche site, and it took just over an hour to bang together in a plain text editor. So what do I need a WYSIWYG editor for at all??

    Situation #2

    So I've got my AdSense account, and I start working on a real site now. I spend a few hours working on a basic template page - a frameset, and one fairly simple HTML page, except for having to integrate several affiliate codes, line up tables, etc. I finish it off, check it in my browser, it looks perfect. So I cut the guts of the page, leaving the header and footer, ready to make the next page, but instead of hitting Save As, I accidentally hit Save - and overwrite my completed page that'd I'd spent several hours working on, with a blank page. And as it turns out, NoteTab clears the Undo history when you save the document, so there's no going back.

    So, dread starts setting in as I'm trying to find some way of retrieving this file. It's still there in my browser, I'm looking right at it, but I can't get to the code I'd spent hours handwriting. I hit View Source in my browser, and it shows me the source of the modified/erased page instead. I hit Save Page As from the browser, same result. Because I was viewing from the local copy on my hard drive, it just keeps pulling that file, even though I can see the original right there (at least until I were to hit Refresh or close the browser!).

    In the end, I was saved in the most unlikely way. On a hunch, I selected everything I could see in the browser window, and dragged and dropped it into Netscape Composer. It retained all the formatting perfectly, and much to my joy, didn't garble my code too badly. True, I had to re-enter the various affiliate codes and Javascript (WYSIWYG editors *always* garble external code like that!), but when cleaning the code up took half an hour instead of the several hours it would have taken to redo the page from scratch, or clean up the train wreck that many other WYSIWYG editors would have left from something as simple as that, I sure was glad to have Netscape Composer on hand! Really, the only formatting changes I needed to make were tidiness to conform to my own coding standards for when I have to refer back to the code later - there were almost no added junk tags or mess, and besides, as I said, it messing with my affiliate codes like all WYSIWYG editors do, I could easily have left it if I weren't so picky about code formatting.

    ----------

    So there you have it. In the space of two days, I've proved yet again that a text editor really is all I need to design a completely functional website, but also that it sometimes really does pay to have a WYSIWYG editor around to save your ass when you least expect it!

    That's a day in my life of web design, anyway. Personally though, I'm with Wynnefield on this one - why all the tongue-in-cheek references to people's lack of skill, or open-mindedness, or anything, when it really is just a matter of personal choice and comfort level? I use Microsoft Word instead of WordPerfect, or StarOffice, or any other competitor. Is it because I have a problem with the companies that make these other word processors, or because I have something to prove, or because I'm not good enough for the other programs? No, it's because Microsoft Word just happens to be my preferred choice as a word processor. Why sledge somebody off because they don't happen to like Frontpage, or because they do?
     
  13. zkiller

    zkiller Super Moderator Staff Member

    Messages:
    1,639
    very good post and i agree 100%! and i also remember both hotdog hotmetal and adobe pagemill. :)
     
  14. StephanieCordray

    StephanieCordray New Member

    Messages:
    1,017
    was it pagemill or pagemaker? either way, i didn't like it, lol.
     
  15. ISDProductions

    ISDProductions New Member

    Messages:
    231
  16. QuickNDeadly

    QuickNDeadly New Member

    Messages:
    1
    I think the best way is to learn and do it is using a text editor like BBedit.

    I am a mac user. I use dreamweaver but I started off coding on a notepad like application which also highlights the code you write.

    Yes, dreamweaver like applications will make your job easier but they will never offer you the tools that you can improvise unless you are using dreamweaver's code screen.

    For a starter, use the coding screen all the time. For pro designers, they already know how they can make their work a lot easier and more organized through the tools it offers.

    Now all those being said, Thumbs up for dreamweaver!
     
  17. xdiesel

    xdiesel New Member

    Messages:
    1
  18. wachtn

    wachtn New Member

    Messages:
    107
    Be careful. Notepad tends to lose indentions making it not such a great choice for code editing. I use it too, mostly for code reading.

    Try notepad++ its wonderful!! Even has built in FTP.
     
  19. hooligan

    hooligan New Member

    Messages:
    13
    I use "web page maker" off The pirate bay.

    VERY easy to use for a complete noob with a lot of tools. I need to learn how to use the big guns though, like dreamweaver.
     
  20. LouTheDesigner

    LouTheDesigner New Member

    Messages:
    506
    Dreamweaver all the way; hands down. GoLive was nice, and I used to dislike Dreamweaver simply because I was a GoLive fan, but CS3 led me toward dreamweaver.

    I honestly can't stand people with their tough-guy notepad hand-coding... I hand coded when I was 11 -- move on and use some software that will save some time. Of course you can make a site using notepad, but why not save some time using Dreamweaver? Are you too cool for ease of use? Are you forgetting how sophisticated Dreamweaver's file management/organization system can be? Are you completely oblivious to it's behaviors panel?
     

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